Thanks for all the great thought-provoking posts, Anejre!

I've long been convinced that Ed II was born well before his time. For instance, he went on holiday for a month in the Fens in the autumn of 1315, with "a great concourse of simple people" - horrifying to his contemps, nice to us, the king with the common touch! The chronicler Robert of Reading wrote sarcastically that Ed went "to refresh his soul with many waters", incomprehensible in the 14c - Ed was centuries ahead of his time in recognising the therapeutic value of spending time near water!

Agree with you about Isabella. Kings (and noblemen) were not expected to be faithful, and as far as Ed's relationship with Piers was concerned, she was no worse off than the *many* queens who had to watch their husbands flaunting their mistresses (and male favourites, in the case of James VI and I). I doubt Isa was jealous of Piers and Hugh Despenser in a personal sense, but hated Hugh because he influenced Ed to reduce her income. Piers never did that, and she tolerated him.

Ed's sexuality is complex, isn't it?! I assume he was bisexual, although of course that's applying a much later label to him.

The Chaplais bio is 134 pages, and the Hamilton 170, including notes. They're both pretty academic, and the Hamilton one has quite a lot on Piers' estates. I would recommend them, but they are terribly pricy - I had to wait ages to find reasonably priced copies! The Hamilton is a chronological narrative beginning with facts about Piers' family, then Piers himself from 1297 to 1312. I enjoyed the appendix, which contains the loooooong list of Piers' possessions seized by Lancaster in 1312. The man was certainly not lacking in style.

The first chapter of the Chaplais details his theory that Ed and Piers were adoptive brothers, then it's a chronological narrative of Piers' life.

Thanks for the info on the books - and I managed to order a reasonably priced copy of Hamilton's book:) I can't see me lasting out on the Chaplais book for long either!

I shall get round to posting about Edward being ahead of his time on the appropriate message board. Suffice to say for now - it's amazing how Edward's pursuits were seen as 'strange' and yet the monarchy has been slated for centuries for being out of touch with the people!

I've just finished reading 'The confession of Piers Gaveston' - a short book finished in 3 days. I could discuss this in books, but as it's about Piers, will do so here. Anyone else read this book and if so, any thoughts?

I thought it started promisingly - well, any book on Piers has to, right? as there are so few. But by the end, I was rather upset by the portrayal. I could handle the accusation of witchcraft directed at his mother - a tactic used throughout these times to tarnish the character of a person - and maybe the child abuse allegations - but then the novel turns Piers into, well, a tart without a heart, until he meets Edward - literally. In this novel, Piers earns his living selling his body - at a very good price - and seals up his heart, until he meets and falls in love with Edward. Only problem is, once they sleep together, it spoils the relationship as Piers feels like a well kept whore and Edward turns into sex pest unable to keep his hands off Piers - at one point, even forcing himself on Piers. And all the time, Piers is still trading his body and sleeping with anyone with money and a pulse! Piers sours on Edward when he won't take him seriously about anything and resolves to leave him, but finds it difficult to break free.

All the time, the author paints Piers as a pouting poppet at court! He makes a point about Piers and Edward being manly, but then has Piers flirting with every lord at court in front of Edward and behaving in an effeminate way. Like a 13th century Julian Clary! Edward is seen as a buffoon.

The ending is horrible for Piers - yearning for Pembroke, kidnapped by Warwick, who then allows some of his men to rape Piers, who then, knowing he faces certain death, flirts and has sex with a guard called Geoffrey in order that he help look his best for his 'execution' and that he will pass on his secret diary. The diary ends up with Pembroke, who laments what mght have been.

btw, I LOVE JUlian Clary - have seen his live show many times, but he's not my idea of Piers Gaveston! I don't like the way the author continually has Piers referring to himself as a 'great whore', and that even when he leaves Edward to go into exile the third time, he plans to set himself up as a courtesan in Rome as he reckons he has at least 10 years with his looks to make his fortune. Also, the relatinship with Edward is hollow.

I would have preferred that once he got together with Edward, he left his past behind him.

Haven't read it and from the looks of it I don't think I will...

Sounds like a soap opera - days of our 14th C lives, perhaps.

Starring: Julian Clary as Piers and the "only gay in the village" as Edward II.

ROTFL! Melisende! Yes, that just about sums it up!

Hi Elflady - just checking out the cover is off-outting! A sinister Piers in the shadows with his hand on an angelic looking Edward! Still, the title was just too intriguing to pass it up.

oh, and I gave in and bought the Chaplais book:)

Actually, Ed is a bit like a sex pest in one of those Carry On films - all he can think about is Piers body! In some parts, the author does try and exhibit some humour - for example, when Piers meets Ed and Isabella when they land in England, Ed insists on travelling in a coach with Piers and tells Isabella the coach is too rickety for her - he bundles her into Lancaster's coach, and then pounces on Piers in their coach. It's a short journey, but enough for Ed to get what he wants. When they arrive at the palace, Ed and Piers emerge from the coach dishevelled, and Ed tries to re-arrange his clothes and tells Isabella something along the lines of 'I told you it was too rickety'!

The devil and his temptation, LOL! Hmm, I really dislike the idea of Piers being presented as a masculine tart and reducing people to the general line "it's all about sex". It's not written by Sandra Brown, is it?

Okay - recast Sid James as Edward II!

My Hamilton bio of Piers arrived today!